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1/144 scale yasen class sub

R/C Submarine modelers

1/144 scale yasen class sub

Postby Christian1944 » Wed Jun 06, 2012 1:52 pm

I am new at this hobby but I'm trying to build a yasen class sub using a piston ballast. I'm not sure what I need to make it though. I don't have a wtc made yet either so any suggestions on how to make one would be helpful.
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Re: 1/144 scale yasen class sub

Postby Sub culture » Wed Jun 06, 2012 3:59 pm

An ambitious project for someone new to the hobby.

Most people start with a kit or two before progressing towards a scratchbuild. You don't have to follow that path, but you should be prepared for a long journey with a few bumps along the way, and it's all uphill.

Helpful if you can outline your range of skills, tools and equipment you have to hand and previous modelling experience.
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Re: 1/144 scale yasen class sub

Postby Christian1944 » Wed Jun 06, 2012 4:31 pm

I plan to scratch build it. I would also like to use a piston ballast system so that it is a static diver. I don't know what else I need but I have a good motor, esc with reverse, 4 ch. remote with a receiver, and plenty of servos. Please tell me if I need anything else.
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Re: 1/144 scale yasen class sub

Postby Sub culture » Wed Jun 06, 2012 5:30 pm

One thing to bear in mind is that there are only a couple of options for ready made piston tanks, and the main one, Engel will not fit that boat at that scale unless it's a dry hull. The other option is Pirahna Modellbau, who do a smaller tank, which will fit in a module. Or you can build your own.

You don't have to use a piston tank however, you can sue water pump based or air pump based systems, or gas.

Have a seach on this forum, you'll find other threads in the oast which show people buildign their own WTC/modules, hulls etc.
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Re: 1/144 scale yasen class sub

Postby Christian1944 » Wed Jun 06, 2012 5:42 pm

I have seen the one made by Engel and my wtc can't be 4 inches in diameter because it would be to big. I haven seen the smaller one but I would like to make one that way I can make it to fit my sub. I have all-thread, which is just a rod that is threaded all the way down, and a motor with a gear that has a nut in the middle. I also have o rings to make it water tight. The hull is 29 inches long and it is 3.75 inches in diameter. My wtc that I'm going to make will be about 2.5 to 3 inches in diameter. The hull will be " freee flooding."
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Re: 1/144 scale yasen class sub

Postby Christian1944 » Wed Jun 06, 2012 10:47 pm

My wtc will be 21 inches long. How big does the ballast tank need to be in order for it to sink to about 5 feet? I figure 10 inches will be enough. Will that be to much or to little?
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Re: 1/144 scale yasen class sub

Postby Sub culture » Thu Jun 07, 2012 4:41 am

You don't work out ballast tank volumes that way.

First of all you need to build your hull, when you have that done, then you are ready to start planning the wtc and ballast system.
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Re: 1/144 scale yasen class sub

Postby Christian1944 » Thu Jun 07, 2012 9:22 am

Ok I'm almost done with the hull. I made it out of papier mâché so that it is strong and light weight. I will coat it in acrylic paint to water proof it. Sine the hull is mostly paper mad starch I can shape it however I need to in order to build it to scale.
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Re: 1/144 scale yasen class sub

Postby Christian1944 » Thu Jun 07, 2012 12:04 pm

I have two different size servos. Should I use a micro or large servo? Also is a 72 MHz radio ok to use underwater? I think the rest of my electronics should be ok to use.
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Re: 1/144 scale yasen class sub

Postby Sub culture » Thu Jun 07, 2012 3:18 pm

You should use 75mhz for ground, 72mhz is for air. Micro or standard servo? Either will be okay, fit whatever squeezes in.

Papier mâché, hmmm, not the first choice of material for a submarine. You will need more than paint to seal it. It will need a thorough coat of resin inside and out if it's to stand a chance of lasting.

If you do a searchon this forum for 'sizing a ballast tank' it should give you some useful techniques for doing so.
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Re: 1/144 scale yasen class sub

Postby Christian1944 » Thu Jun 07, 2012 3:29 pm

Ok thanks. I'll get some epoxy resin to coat it or maybe some boat varnish. I can try to change my remote to 75 MHz but I also have a 2.4 ghz that I know a lot of people are using. I also found out how to size my ballast. I will need to weigh it and test it but it should work. For the tank it self have you heard of any one using a calk tube for a small piston tank? I will keep you filled in on the build and I'll continue to ask questions if I run into a problem. Thanks.
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Re: 1/144 scale yasen class sub

Postby JWLaRue » Thu Jun 07, 2012 6:02 pm

A 2.4GHz radio will not work for submerged operations. At best you might get an inch or so of depth before loss of control. Water just absorbs the radiation energy. (Think what happens when you put a cup of water in a microwave. It uses the same frequency. :) )

By itself, weighing your hull will *not* yield a very useful data point for sizing a ballast tank. If you do not want to do it by trial-and-error (which most of us do!), then what you need to know is what is the displacement of everything that sits at and above the surfaced waterline. That will tell you the volume that the ballast tank needs to shift/move to allow the sub to settle to a submerged state.

Using a 75MHz radio is the correct choice if you are in the U.S.....if you are not, let us know and we can tell you what frequency you should use.

-hope this helps,

Jeff
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Re: 1/144 scale yasen class sub

Postby Christian1944 » Thu Jun 07, 2012 6:26 pm

Thanks and I was going to weigh it with every thing in it submerged and at the surface and find the difference in weight. I'm assuming that if my ballast is full it should weigh that amount or a little more to submerge it. Is that the correct way to find the size needed for the ballast tank?
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Re: 1/144 scale yasen class sub

Postby Christian1944 » Thu Jun 07, 2012 7:15 pm

I have a JR 4 ch remote that is 72 MHz but I think I can convert it to a 75 MHz. My only problem is that I live in a small town and there isn't a hobby shop here to do it. Can anyone explain to me how to convert it?
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Re: 1/144 scale yasen class sub

Postby JWLaRue » Thu Jun 07, 2012 7:58 pm

Christian1944 wrote:Thanks and I was going to weigh it with every thing in it submerged and at the surface and find the difference in weight. I'm assuming that if my ballast is full it should weigh that amount or a little more to submerge it. Is that the correct way to find the size needed for the ballast tank?

I'd have to think about that one....by immediate response is that this doesn't sound right.......but let me noodle on it.

The way I figure ballast tank size is to first get a submerged trim. Then add foam below the waterline until I have a correct surfaced trim. The volume of the foam that was added is the volume that you need for the ballast tank.

-Jeff
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