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Water Cooling Subs

Post your favorite modeling 'tips' and 'tricks'

Postby JWLaRue » Wed May 20, 2009 9:49 pm

aquadeep wrote: ......its a free country still as far as I know and ones opinion can still be expressed hopefully with an open minded audiance and you or others don't have to raed it :roll:


I love how folks who wave the "it's a free country, etc' flag are the first to have a problem when others choose to exercise the very same freedom...... :roll:

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Postby aquadeep » Thu May 21, 2009 12:31 am

Very well said ,thats the spirit!

Freedom of speach and all that wonderfull stuff :D

I have no problem waving or dying for those rights ,just like the next guy he has his :D
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Telemetry

Postby tincanrider » Thu May 21, 2009 11:18 am

Been reading the post,insteresting and getting a little too deep. is there a simple system out there that gives depth, speed and compas direction, would like to put such a system in my OTW type VII. Keith
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Postby Rogue Sub » Thu May 21, 2009 11:31 am

OH you havent experienced hot untill you have stood upper level in the engine room!

How much extra motor life do you think you are getting from the ~15degree difference in operating temperature.

What is the difference in your run time with and without cooling.

These are the 2 things you are trying to increase as stated in the first part of your initial post. What are the numbers for these, that is the data you really need.

Not whether or not the coil actually did cool the motor.
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Postby Rogue Sub » Thu May 21, 2009 12:19 pm

.....
Last edited by Rogue Sub on Thu May 21, 2009 8:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby aquadeep » Thu May 21, 2009 5:32 pm

Yes but why let the motot get warmer than it has to,after all these are cordless motor drill drives that are intendid for air to circulate around and inside with the fan on the armiture.Would one dispute why the malkers of the motors " BOTH" install cooling fans on the motors?The point is just that I found that these motor drives as well as the other one I use run cooler,even if its just 5 degrees its worth it to me ,maybe not others ,but to me.

As I have said put in your sub your own ideas make it work if not its just dead wait and not serving a benificial perpose to your sub.

I incurrage hole harterly with a passtion that we all embrace to improve the operational aspect of our subs ,exchange ideas,without prijiduce or bias.

"YES WE CAN" do it now with a greater accuracy than ever before because no one has put a Telemetry system on a RC Sub before that I know of in the general public and not just here in the US but in the rest of the world.

Now I and others can share raw hard data just like the Heli boys and Boat guys and Jet/prop guys do ,no body forced it on them,they wen't and got it on there machines so that critical systems can be monitored.

I must make a video of the system reading the 2 cooled and non cooled motors or perhapse a member can come over and see it in operation in the test tank.

Tonight I will run my u-32 in the tank at normal cruise with the cooling off and then the same time again after cool down and will post the results or show a chart that the system generates .

I haven't got a digital camcorder to demonstrate it over the required time span so you might have to wait for a video.

I know this telemtry system sounds complex and a bit deep but I am no computer wiz I only have basic understanding of computers and electronic systems,thats why I love this system its "literaly plug and play",no hassles to get temps or RPM read outs emediatly "OUT" of your sub.

Now the depth sensor aspect will need some refining and thats what I like wouldn't you?And it should be very easy for someone into micro chips and programing to adapt the right sensor,there are 2 analog ports that allow for the user to connect his own sensors and is stipulated in the manual.

Just don't mess with the barometric or other sensor that is built into the board or it will void the warranty,no beggie that can be done,I know I will,and eventualy a good depth reading sensor will be found that, well read in cms or is calibrated to water pressures no mater the altitude,its all out there its just a matter of finding the right cambination.

As far as I know Keith there is no simpler more user fendly and cost effective unit outthere unless home built .The compass will eventualy be incorperated into the sysytem as robots are useing them now and I bet they have figured it out by now I will investigate that as well,because GPS will only probably penetrate a few inches.
Oh ya I can Imagine just how hot it must get in those engine rooms and sypathise completly on the men that man them.

I remember the SR-71 returning from a mission in Okinawa and how incredibly hot the wings where from air friction even after it landed and the engines my god. :shock: I was a Heavy Jet Mechanic in the Air Force a long time ago.
As i said before if I did not see the temps with and without cooling than I might have been inclined to add more cooling it would not hurt any thing and a coler motor even if its just a little coloer is just a bit more happier :D

Who knows or who realy cares how long it increas the motors logevity it will have in its long life in the sub thats a given and vertualy impossble thing to maesure as other factors that play a role ,I can only give general observations but for sure its benificial.

As sunworksco said don't sweat the small degees and that is also my hole point in the debate its no big deal to do it or not,but I do it for my raesons.

And will naturaly respect those that don't.

Dave :D
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Postby Rogue Sub » Thu May 21, 2009 5:41 pm

....
Last edited by Rogue Sub on Thu May 21, 2009 8:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Skip Asay » Thu May 21, 2009 7:01 pm

OK. I’m confused. Isn’t the title of this thread “Water Cooling Subs”? If so, why aren’t we sticking to that instead of discussing telemetry which, by the way, has its own thread?

Going through all the work necessary to install water cooling to be able to drop the temperature only 5 degrees just isn’t worth it. No way. No how. You’ll see more than 5 degrees difference between the 60 degree day and the 80 degree day. It just isn’t worth it. And using drill motors may or may not be a good thing but the bottom line is still matching the motor to the reduction to the prop. Period. End of story. Cure the problem not the symptom. And Dave, don’t waste the time pointing out about how all the full size cars, trucks, boats ships, etc. all use water cooling so therefore it’s alright for us to do it. It just doesn’t apply. Cooling is used to reduce excess heat. If you’ve built your boat properly, guess what? There’s no excess heat to get rid of. It’s that simple and all the analogies in the world won’t change that.

I’ll repeat my challenge. Add just a 2:1 reduction to whatever is coming out of the drill motor gear box and see what happens. If you’ll allow it, it will surprise you. I’m not about to hold my breath, though.

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Postby JWLaRue » Thu May 21, 2009 7:22 pm

Skip,

...you noticed that too, eh? Everywhere David goes, he's essentially pushing something that he's selling. The telemetry kick he's on will end up being something he sells......you watch.

I have no problem with vendors. This hobby exists because of them. Much of what I learned, I learned from vendors. But I think we need to find a way to limit the constant, in your face, pushing of product. How about it Myles?

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Postby Albion » Thu May 21, 2009 7:32 pm

aquadeep wrote:Yes but why let the motot get warmer than it has to,after all these are cordless motor drill drives that are intendid for air to circulate around and inside with the fan on the armiture.Would one dispute why the malkers of the motors " BOTH" install cooling fans on the motors?The point is just that I found that these motor drives as well as the other one I use run cooler,even if its just 5 degrees its worth it to me ,maybe not others ,but to me.

Theres your problem right thehe. These motors need cooling, they are designed for short runnin ghigh power output, so they need cooling. You are using the wrong motor for the job , period
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Postby Myles Yancey » Thu May 21, 2009 7:57 pm

[quote="JWLaRue"]Skip,

...you noticed that too, eh? Everywhere David goes, he's essentially pushing something that he's selling. The telemetry kick he's on will end up being something he sells......you watch.

by the way I agree with this statment Jeff, i have been watching it on 2 other boards and that is what I have been saying.

I have no problem with vendors. This hobby exists because of them. Much of what I learned, I learned from vendors. But I think we need to find a way to limit the constant, in your face, pushing of product. How about it Myles?

you are correct again about venders we are all learning fromm them.

Yes I will get inviolved in this ""constant, in your face, pushing of product"'
it is too bad one person has push this to this point, Dave don't say I did not try and warn you, you have brought this on everyone. [/b
I will keep you all posted. Thanks again Myles
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Postby redboat219 » Fri May 22, 2009 12:28 pm

Too bad he doesn't see beauty in simplicity. The more complex a system becomes the higher the chances of one or more components failing during a critical time. Also your motor will have to work harder just to carry the add weight of those "extra" components. :)

If you really need to install cooling why not just do what the FE boaters do with water from the outside flowing through a simple copper coil wound around the motor.
"Make it simple, make it strong-and make it work!" - Mikhail Mil
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Postby aquadeep » Fri May 22, 2009 3:21 pm

Yes a pick up tube would be nice and very scale like even as was done on the Alfa's full scale intake ports for the reactors cooling exchanger,you know they even had to install a baffling section.
But alas I tried to do the same on one sub a while back and the tube had to be much to large to force watter into and around to reach the motor and then back out again, as I don't believe my subs go quite as fast as the rascing boats ,so I went back to the system that does work and its the one shown in the secound diagram. :roll:

I guess the other guys must still need cooling of some sort on there motors they just won't be cool and throw around inuendos they don't even have proof of,pleae I beg of you contact Eagle Tree Syatems and ask them if I am a traveling salesman out to steel yuor money on some gadget,I which i made this babby though!

You know the old saying "if you can't take the heat stay out of the kitchen" :cry:

Now would it be to much to ask for you gents to just calm down ,and have a Cervesa and wait a bit till I can post some interesting data on the tests that are in progress I have made?

:D :D
Last edited by aquadeep on Fri May 22, 2009 3:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby aquadeep » Fri May 22, 2009 3:29 pm

Albion I which I was using bthe rong motor that way the telemitry would make me change it to somthing else I would not need guese at it.

Its not to keep a hot motor cool as is on serface speed bouts but to "keep a cool motor cooler" It takes an awfull lot to overhaet a drill motor when loaded unlees there junk.
BTW my Dewalt motor trany in the test sub cost only 3 bucks ata flea market and there alwas sold there used and in pawn shops.So cost or trying to presevean expensive piece of machinery is not the issue.
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Postby JWLaRue » Fri May 22, 2009 3:51 pm

You're still describing a means to fix a bad engineering choice. The cost and complexity of adding the extra bits for water cooling do not offset the decision to use a low(?) cost motor that gets warm enough to need the cooling.

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